1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

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Bruce69Camaro
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Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#31 Post by Bruce69Camaro » Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:57 am

Talked to a good friend that worked for S&W Racecars and he said the best things for you to do, is used Calvert Racing items and so far, you got just about everything but the Split mono's.

A lot of the guys on this site will can help you with them.
Those who think they know it all have no way of finding out they don't......... :scratch:

raffaplymouth
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:07 pm

Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#32 Post by raffaplymouth » Thu Jul 26, 2012 3:08 pm

Bruce69Camaro wrote:Talked to a good friend that worked for S&W Racecars and he said the best things for you to do, is used Calvert Racing items and so far, you got just about everything but the Split mono's.

A lot of the guys on this site will can help you with them.
wow .. you have speak with this guys ? i know that monoleaf is better ...i think will buy after the race .. now is too late .. tomorrow i will work on subframe .. need build for exhaust side problem ...is very difficult .. i will remove also the swaybar ..
on summitracing i have buy all for connect the valve cover breather on the headers .. , now the breather blown on the floor .. for italian race in not possible this ..i have buy also the wheel screw set and tube .. i will install also this but i dont know the procedure for drill the wheels and tire , someone know ??
1970 Super Cuda 496 Indyheads
ET 9.32@148 1.42 60ft (250 shot ) :shock:

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Bruce69Camaro
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Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#33 Post by Bruce69Camaro » Fri Jul 27, 2012 5:29 am

Here's a very good article and how to install rim screws. Of course it's a lot easier if you purchase the templete then that takes all the guess work out of things.

http://www.superchevy.com/technical/cha ... screw_kit/

Good luck
Those who think they know it all have no way of finding out they don't......... :scratch:

raffaplymouth
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:07 pm

Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#34 Post by raffaplymouth » Fri Jul 27, 2012 12:52 pm

Bruce69Camaro wrote:Here's a very good article and how to install rim screws. Of course it's a lot easier if you purchase the templete then that takes all the guess work out of things.

http://www.superchevy.com/technical/cha ... screw_kit/

Good luck
i read !! look like easy ... a question guys ...i just build the subframe, steel bar square 2" X 5/8" section is enough ?? i dont have much space for exhaust side .... i will connect rear rail to front rail ...
1970 Super Cuda 496 Indyheads
ET 9.32@148 1.42 60ft (250 shot ) :shock:

raffaplymouth
Posts: 162
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Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#35 Post by raffaplymouth » Fri Jul 27, 2012 1:53 pm

I JUST REMOVED NOW THE FRONT SWAYBAR AND LINK , I HAVE REMOVED ALSO A CROSSMEMBER ON THE BACK OF FRONT BUMPER , WAS VERY HEAVY ..TOMORROW I WILL REMOVE THE HIFI SYSTEM , AMPLIFIER AND SPEAKER ...
1970 Super Cuda 496 Indyheads
ET 9.32@148 1.42 60ft (250 shot ) :shock:

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Hookdaddy
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Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#36 Post by Hookdaddy » Sat Jul 28, 2012 9:40 pm

raffaplymouth wrote:
Bruce69Camaro wrote:Talked to a good friend that worked for S&W Racecars and he said the best things for you to do, is used Calvert Racing items and so far, you got just about everything but the Split mono's.

A lot of the guys on this site will can help you with them.
wow .. you have speak with this guys ?
Yeah Raff we admit to knowing Bruce - :thumb: He did a great job installing an S&W backhalf in his Camaro.

Here's my opinion of your Cuda. 138 mph tells me you have 9.70-9.80 horsepower. I friend I race with has a 67 Dart 550" wedge. Now his is an automatic with an S&W 4-link and 14x32 tires - so hooking it up is never a problem. It runs 10 flat at 134 and change. I also have a stock LT-1 94 Camaro that runs high 13's and has a 60' time of 1.93 So we know where your problem lies - TRACTION.

I watched you videos and it don't transfer weight. As Bruce advised you need to loosen up the front and get it to lift..
you spent your money on the right rear suspension parts - Calverts are the best.

There are plenty of NHRA Stock Eliminator cars running on 9" tires running high 8 and low 9's so it can be done.

My next worry is the quality of the tracks you have to race on and the amount of starting line prep. To run 9's on little tire you need a properly preped race track - and I have my doubts.

Of course the easy answer is TUB IT. S&W ships world wide. and if you have any welding skills, can follow instructions and take your time you can do it yourself. Bruce is living proof and he'll tell you our tech support is second to none.

Good luck with that thing.
Don Scholl
S&W Race Cars - retired
145H Super Comp
145Y Stock Eliminator & ET Brackets

raffaplymouth
Posts: 162
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Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#37 Post by raffaplymouth » Sun Jul 29, 2012 7:11 am

Hi Don ! thank for your help ! yes , look like the car have much more horsepower ... the problem is on the traction . i see SeW website ... wow look like very specialist ... but now i dont have time for this big work .. i dont understand " TUB .IT ??? is the roll bar ?? ...i know my engine can make 9 sec ... but im would happy if i make also 10.50!! i know 4 link is the way !! but he need cut the rear inner fender .... i dont like this .. my tires are 28-10.50-15 , is not possible install tires more large ...

for the track you right , i dont think was good ... is glued , prepped but i dont know if is good like american track ...we are better at making spaghetti!!
1970 Super Cuda 496 Indyheads
ET 9.32@148 1.42 60ft (250 shot ) :shock:

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wikd69
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Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#38 Post by wikd69 » Sun Jul 29, 2012 3:09 pm

Hookdaddy wrote: ...
Here's my opinion of your Cuda. 138 mph tells me you have 9.70-9.80 horsepower. I friend I race with has a 67 Dart 550" wedge. Now his is an automatic with an S&W 4-link and 14x32 tires - so hooking it up is never a problem. It runs 10 flat at 134 and change. I also have a stock LT-1 94 Camaro that runs high 13's and has a 60' time of 1.93 So we know where your problem lies - TRACTION.
Don - I was thinking pretty much the same thing. Mine weighs just over 3700 with a 139 mph top end, turning 9.75 - we think mine is probably delivering somewhere around 900 at the flywheel. I think that if Raffaele can get that thing to hook, he should be deep in the 10's, at least.

Raffaelle, here is a possible concern: Do your tracks there require NHRA tech inspections ? If so, you'll probably run into a problem once you dip into the 10's and for certain if you break into the 9's. In watching your videos I don't see a roll bar or cage in your Cuda. Here in the US, NHRA is really strict about that - anything 11.49 and faster requires a roll bar, and anything faster than 10.00 requires a full cage. I don't know if your track follows NHRA rules but it's something to consider once you start hitting lower ET's.

Also, you said you run 11 psi in your rear tires. I would experiment with dropping those pressures. I'm running Hoosier 29.5 x 11.5w D06 compound slicks on mine with rim screws and normally run them at 9.00 psi. Your application may vary but I'm betting 11 psi is too much and may be contributing to your traction problems. Try dropping your pressures down to 10 lbs or lower and see if that helps any. I don't know if the tire type you're running is engineered to run these lower pressures so you want to be cautious dropping your psi too far, especially if you're not using rim screws to lock the beads. ( http://www.mickeythompsontires.com/tech.php?bulletin=s4 )..

The fellow I talked to about my slicks stated that on a heavy car like mine (and yours) a stiffer sidewall was best because it carried the load better while allowing lower psi's at the track. Just something to consider.

Good luck with your effort ! Btw, I love the color and the way you've put the car together - it's a great ride :smt003
1969 ProStreet Camaro RS Best 9.75@139 1.46 60'
Blown 427 BBC, TH400 w/Brake, Back-Half Ladderbar
Narrowed 12-Bolt, 4.10 Gears, Spool, Moser 33 Spline

http://www.marsh-racing.com/harrys_camaro-1.htm

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wikd69
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Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#39 Post by wikd69 » Sun Jul 29, 2012 5:33 pm

Hmmm...

Just used the HP calculator on Dragtimes.com and it's telling me I should be making 785 hp at the fw.

http://www.dragtimes.com/horsepower-et- ... r+Estimate

I've had other sites calculate upwards of 900. Anybody have a guess ? It'd be interesting to come up with a reliable calculator to determine what Raeffael's HP output might be, given his high top end speed and estimated ET.
1969 ProStreet Camaro RS Best 9.75@139 1.46 60'
Blown 427 BBC, TH400 w/Brake, Back-Half Ladderbar
Narrowed 12-Bolt, 4.10 Gears, Spool, Moser 33 Spline

http://www.marsh-racing.com/harrys_camaro-1.htm

raffaplymouth
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:07 pm

Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#40 Post by raffaplymouth » Sun Jul 29, 2012 6:00 pm

wikd69 wrote:
Hookdaddy wrote: ...
Here's my opinion of your Cuda. 138 mph tells me you have 9.70-9.80 horsepower. I friend I race with has a 67 Dart 550" wedge. Now his is an automatic with an S&W 4-link and 14x32 tires - so hooking it up is never a problem. It runs 10 flat at 134 and change. I also have a stock LT-1 94 Camaro that runs high 13's and has a 60' time of 1.93 So we know where your problem lies - TRACTION.
Don - I was thinking pretty much the same thing. Mine weighs just over 3700 with a 139 mph top end, turning 9.75 - we think mine is probably delivering somewhere around 900 at the flywheel. I think that if Raffaele can get that thing to hook, he should be deep in the 10's, at least.

Raffaelle, here is a possible concern: Do your tracks there require NHRA tech inspections ? If so, you'll probably run into a problem once you dip into the 10's and for certain if you break into the 9's. In watching your videos I don't see a roll bar or cage in your Cuda. Here in the US, NHRA is really strict about that - anything 11.49 and faster requires a roll bar, and anything faster than 10.00 requires a full cage. I don't know if your track follows NHRA rules but it's something to consider once you start hitting lower ET's.

Also, you said you run 11 psi in your rear tires. I would experiment with dropping those pressures. I'm running Hoosier 29.5 x 11.5w D06 compound slicks on mine with rim screws and normally run them at 9.00 psi. Your application may vary but I'm betting 11 psi is too much and may be contributing to your traction problems. Try dropping your pressures down to 10 lbs or lower and see if that helps any. I don't know if the tire type you're running is engineered to run these lower pressures so you want to be cautious dropping your psi too far, especially if you're not using rim screws to lock the beads. ( http://www.mickeythompsontires.com/tech.php?bulletin=s4 )..

The fellow I talked to about my slicks stated that on a heavy car like mine (and yours) a stiffer sidewall was best because it carried the load better while allowing lower psi's at the track. Just something to consider.

Good luck with your effort ! Btw, I love the color and the way you've put the car together - it's a great ride :smt003
Hi ! Thanks for your help ! No NHRA CONTROLS in italy Races ..but is obligatory the roll bar for 10 sec cars ...my best time was 11,48@138 1,99 60ft with 0-110 mPh wheelspin ...with drag slick MT M5 coumpound ...is too hard ?? Tomorrow i will install wheel screws..
1970 Super Cuda 496 Indyheads
ET 9.32@148 1.42 60ft (250 shot ) :shock:

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wikd69
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Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#41 Post by wikd69 » Sun Jul 29, 2012 7:25 pm

raffaplymouth wrote:Hi ! Thanks for your help ! No NHRA CONTROLS in italy Races ..but is obligatory the roll bar for 10 sec cars ...my best time was 11,48@138 1,99 60ft with 0-110 mPh wheelspin ...with drag slick MT M5 coumpound ...is too hard ?? Tomorrow i will install wheel screws..
from http://www.mickeythompsontires.com/stri ... tem=ETDrag

ET Drag

MICKEY THOMPSON COMPOUND SELECTION CHART

Medium----------------------------------------------------------------Soft
M7 X5 M5 M8 R1 L8 X7 L4

L4 - Soft compound for Dragsters, lightweight vehicles and vehicles without rear suspension.
L8 - Good compound for general use.
M5 - Good compound for general use.
M7 - Good compound for general use.
R1 - Special Compound for ET Drag Radial.
X5 - Cooler running version of M5.
X7 - Cooler running version of L7.

Your M5 compound may be ok, but after you get the rim screws in I'd drop your tire pressure down a bit. I'm betting 11 psi is way too high for the track - any of you more seasoned guys want to comment on this point ?

Also, it'd be helpful to get someone to take some rear quarter HD video of your burnout and your launch. Going frame by frame afterwards will give you a chance to see what the rear end is doing, how the sidewalls are working and generally get an idea of what to try next. HD video will also show what sort of motion you get at launch, what the body is doing and how your front end lift and/or weight transfer is working. You need weight transfer but not enough to kill the launch - just enough to allow the slicks to roll in, plant and set the slicks up for best hook.

But to start with, I'd drop the tire pressure down a bunch and make sure you get some heat in the compound to get it working. Too hard or too cool = no hook...
1969 ProStreet Camaro RS Best 9.75@139 1.46 60'
Blown 427 BBC, TH400 w/Brake, Back-Half Ladderbar
Narrowed 12-Bolt, 4.10 Gears, Spool, Moser 33 Spline

http://www.marsh-racing.com/harrys_camaro-1.htm

raffaplymouth
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:07 pm

Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#42 Post by raffaplymouth » Sun Jul 29, 2012 11:59 pm

wikd69 wrote:
raffaplymouth wrote:Hi ! Thanks for your help ! No NHRA CONTROLS in italy Races ..but is obligatory the roll bar for 10 sec cars ...my best time was 11,48@138 1,99 60ft with 0-110 mPh wheelspin ...with drag slick MT M5 coumpound ...is too hard ?? Tomorrow i will install wheel screws..
from http://www.mickeythompsontires.com/stri ... tem=ETDrag

ET Drag

MICKEY THOMPSON COMPOUND SELECTION CHART

Medium----------------------------------------------------------------Soft
M7 X5 M5 M8 R1 L8 X7 L4

L4 - Soft compound for Dragsters, lightweight vehicles and vehicles without rear suspension.
L8 - Good compound for general use.
M5 - Good compound for general use.
M7 - Good compound for general use.
R1 - Special Compound for ET Drag Radial.
X5 - Cooler running version of M5.
X7 - Cooler running version of L7.

Your M5 compound may be ok, but after you get the rim screws in I'd drop your tire pressure down a bit. I'm betting 11 psi is way too high for the track - any of you more seasoned guys want to comment on this point ?

Also, it'd be helpful to get someone to take some rear quarter HD video of your burnout and your launch. Going frame by frame afterwards will give you a chance to see what the rear end is doing, how the sidewalls are working and generally get an idea of what to try next. HD video will also show what sort of motion you get at launch, what the body is doing and how your front end lift and/or weight transfer is working. You need weight transfer but not enough to kill the launch - just enough to allow the slicks to roll in, plant and set the slicks up for best hook.

But to start with, I'd drop the tire pressure down a bunch and make sure you get some heat in the compound to get it working. Too hard or too cool = no hook...
about the pressure, I noticed that lowering .. worse stability at high speed ... you confirm? can become dangerous? you remember...i dont have the swaybar ... i will make a new video ASAP ...thanks !!
Last edited by raffaplymouth on Mon Jul 30, 2012 12:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
1970 Super Cuda 496 Indyheads
ET 9.32@148 1.42 60ft (250 shot ) :shock:

raffaplymouth
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:07 pm

Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#43 Post by raffaplymouth » Mon Jul 30, 2012 12:15 am

rev limiter and timing retard
Cuda 029.jpg
1970 Super Cuda 496 Indyheads
ET 9.32@148 1.42 60ft (250 shot ) :shock:

raffaplymouth
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:07 pm

Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#44 Post by raffaplymouth » Mon Jul 30, 2012 12:16 am

Subframe connectors
Cuda 024.jpg
1970 Super Cuda 496 Indyheads
ET 9.32@148 1.42 60ft (250 shot ) :shock:

raffaplymouth
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:07 pm

Re: 1970 Cuda 4 speed 60 ft problem

#45 Post by raffaplymouth » Mon Jul 30, 2012 12:17 am

Subframe connectors
Cuda 020.jpg
1970 Super Cuda 496 Indyheads
ET 9.32@148 1.42 60ft (250 shot ) :shock:

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